Peter Consterdine
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Here we have an exclusive interview with martial arts and self protection pioneer Peter Consterdine.
Peter C. on the left
DSD
Peter you started in martial arts at a young age, can us tell me how you got started and who your first teachers were.
Peter
I started my martial arts in 1964 at the age of 15. It was at a Wado Ryu Karate club in Manchester, part of the Sei Do Kan group of clubs and was run by Danny Connor and Martin Stott. Roy Stanhope, who later went on to be the Gt. Britain Team Manager was a brown belt at the time.
Danny, in about 1965/6 went off to the Far East for a few years, leaving Roy and Martin to run the clubs. Martin, shortly after that, packed in Karate, leaving Roy running the show. The clubs were part of the British Karate Association (BKA) at that time.
Shortly after the BKA split with its Japanese Sensei, the Northern clubs became the core of the Shukokai Karate Union (SKU) and was England’s first Shukokai organisation.
I’d been teaching since I was 16 and was one of the founder members of the SKU. The wheel turned full circle in that some years back, Danny re-started the BKA and before I started the BCA with Geoff Thompson, I was it’s Chief Instructor. Since Danny’s death in 2000, the BKA has been run by my old friend and still weekly training partner, Brian Seabright. – one of the UK’s very best martial artists by the way
DSD
Would you say that traditional arts were harder in those days, in terms of the way you trained and the effort you had to put in to earn grades.
Peter
We trained as hard, probably, as we thought we were able to. By today’s standards of martial fitness we were probably a bit short of the mark, but it was still very hard. Karate was certainly more ‘raw’ in those days, contact was a given, but it was some years before we started all the supplementary training – i.e. weights, additional CV etc. The gradings were certainly harder than we see them now and more strict.
DSD
You were one of the first full contact competitors, can you tell us a little about how it felt to take part in those early competitions.
Peter
The early full contact competition convinced me that a traditional martial art, in my case Karate, needed modification to work. A style system works at its best against itself and whilst I won my early bouts with knockouts, I knew that good boxing skills moulded with Karate style punches and kicks were needed, as was ring fitness. Traditional karate competition fitness has no relationship to ‘contact’ ring fitness.
I was probably the only regular GB & England Karate International who moved into the full contact scene.
DSD
What do you think about the growth of mixed martial arts competitions like the Ultimate fighting championship.
Peter
The MMA and Cage competitions are, I suppose, a natural progression, but I see toughness winning out over skill, particularly in the ‘stand-up’ side of the game. With some few exceptions, I don’t see the striking and kicking any better than it was 30+ years ago and in many cases it’s worse. I’m not taking anything away from the bottle, fitness and overall capability of the people, but the aesthetic of good martial arts can be lacking. We wouldn’t pay to see two average skill guys slogging it out in a ring because we’ve come to know how good boxing can get – (see all the greats). Even some of the top guys in MMA look like poor amateur boxers at times.
DSD
Have you ever been inclined to study a grappling art, do you think it is necessary to train at ever range.
Peter
I’ve always had an interest in the grappling and used to train, on occasions, with the wrestlers at the YMCA in Manchester in the 60’s and 70’s. I have a very strong interest in the stand-up grappling and love Judo for this reason. I don’t grapple so as to avoid injuries – it’s that simple, plus I don’t have the time to weld it on to my training programme.
DSD
You gave up running your own school/club why was that..
Peter
I gave up my own clubs many years ago so I could concentrate on my own training but I teach, I suppose, during the training sessions with my long term training partners.
Teaching taught me more about martial arts than anything else did. I’ve always taught by means of breaking a technique into its constituent parts and then showing people how it all fits together, rather than just have people copy what I do. In having to break it down, I get a better understanding of how it works. The Japanese never taught this way.
DSD
You are renowned as one of the hardest hitters in karate, can you tell us how you developed your power strike.
Peter
When I was practicing Wado, I never felt that my impact was sufficient and I did feel I was buying into a myth. I couldn’t square the ‘fresh air’ impact with the real world and despite having a Makiwara in my garden from age 16, I still wasn’t convinced. I was convinced when I saw and ‘felt’ the impact from the Shukokai of Shigeru Kimura and his ‘double hip’ system.
If there was ever a ‘burning bush’ moment for me, this was it, plus the fact that we tested our impact on the ‘Ethafoam’ pads and before they came on the scene, rolled up Gi jackets!
I took the traditional Shukokai striking and kicking and modified it for Street and door work – see next Q.
DSD
You worked on some pretty rough doors, were you able to apply much of your karate to situations that you faced at that time.
Peter
I started working on the doors in 1970 in Manchester and despite my ability by that time to impact, I quickly realized the inadequacy of a ‘trad’ karate or any ‘trad’ martial art to work at close range – especially with no bells, flags, whistles and a referee. Stances were out of the window and the whole proxemics (distancing) issue did not match with the karate thought process.
I brought in elements of Wing Chun, which I’m a big fan of, so as to fill the gap. I brought close range, heavy impact into pre-emptive strikes as well as trapping skills and some standing grappling. I still teach police forces the double hip and pre-emption and for some years I had a contract with the Home Office to teach at what was then National Police Training, exactly these skills. I still teach police forces and other government agencies.
DSD
Do you think that moving into security work was a natural progression from the martial arts or was it something that you actively sought out to do.
Peter
It was a natural progression, as well as the fact that I had been shooting firearms, particularly pistol, since being a teenager. I shot ‘Practical Pistol’ competitions and was good. For many years I’d become a big fan of Dennis Martin and still am (he recently taught his edged weapon defense on a BCA seminar). Dennis was out there gathering a whole raft of knowledge and skills about Combat – in its widest sense – armed, unarmed and role related i.e. Close Protection (Bodyguarding).
In about 1985? I attended one of Dennis’s “CQB Services” Close Protection courses and went on from there. Since then I have worked in over 20+ countries in nearly every continent and looked after a range of top executives of multi-national companies.
I’m now involved in the Security Industry as my primary business and have been for many years.
DSD
Can you tell us what led you to create the British combat association.
Peter
The BCA was created to provide a ‘home’ for Instructors who wanted to break out of the political strictures of the style Associations, particularly for those people who were wanting to develop the ‘practical’ aspects of their particular art. Whilst we set out originally to further the real self-defence aspects of martial arts and because of our apolitical attitude, we have attracted hundreds of clubs into membership that are simply practicing a traditional art. We probably have every martial art represented within the BCA and over 300 instructors. We have police and military instructors.
I’d met Geoff Thompson when I interviewed him for MAI magazine about his book ‘Watch My Back’ and formed an immediate bond. I asked Geoff whether he wanted to join me as joint chief instructor and, as they say, the rest is history.
DSD
With much wider availability and many more arts to choose from today if you were a teenager just starting out would you still choose karate or some other system/style.
Peter
It’s a really good question and I’m struggling for an answer. Given what I know now, though, I would probably still do the Karate, but not accept blindly what I was being told. JKD would, probably, be the best for all round skill and specific study of its roots – i.e. Wing Chun and the Filipino arts. There’s just so much now.
DSD
When most people begin their martial art journey the mystical black belt is their goal, do you feel that priorities change after the shodan level.
Peter
When people get to 4th Dan and above they always become dismissive of the system of gradings, but they have very short memories and forget how getting to Black Belt probably dominated their lives. I like the system, but getting a black belt has now been devalued. The ‘door knocking’ crowd (no names) and some others simply sell grades and standards are now, generally poor.
Simply hunting the next black belt, as your primary goal in martial arts, is not good. After, say 4th Dan, further grades should come because a person is still at the top of their game and working, if anything, harder than previously. The grades should come as a ‘by-product’ of other goals. I try and train harder now than ever, but I know people whose sole purpose is to gain the next grade, when to be fair, they really should be having grades taken off them.
DSD
In recent years there has been a real swing toward what people commonly term reality based self defence, would you say that this has had an effect on traditional arts.
Peter
In both good and bad ways. Good because it’s made people realize that for traditional systems to be effective in a real conflict situation, it needs to be modified.
Bad, because it can be a hiding place for people who simply don’t want to put the time and hard graft into building a foundation of a sound martial arts for themselves. There are too many to count and that’s people who are selling self defence systems and techniques who haven’t had a face to face conflict in their lives and the credibility gap is getting wider I’m afraid.
DSD
What would you class as your greatest achievement in martial arts.
Peter
Lasting this long!!
DSD
What next for Peter Consterdine, do ever see a day when you will retire and take up fishing, maybe on the banks of some windy Scottish loch.
Peter
I’ve done the windy Scottish loch bit, but still found a partner to punch and kick with and to sprint up hills and carry each other on our backs up the same hills, so I’ll just carry on. I’m still training at what I believe is a very high level with some of the very best people in the game and long may it continue!
Peter C
I would like to take this opportunity to thank Peter for taking time out of his busy schedule to do this interview for Dunbar Self Defence, when I moved from traditional to more practical martial training Peter and Geoff were very supportive and inspirational and our club enjoys an excellent relationship with the BCA to this day.
Alan Beckett